25 February 2013

The Truth About Forgiveness (Video)


I reveal what Jesus really did on the cross and share who has forgiveness. What we've learned in church for centuries and by all Christian leaders everywhere is not the Truth. So much of what we've been taught is wrong. Unlearn everything!


28 comments :

said she said...

So, if Jesus died for everyone, does that mean we all get to go to Heaven, no matter what we do or believe?

If so, then... what's the point?

Dathan Ellis said...

So you don't like that Jesus would die for everyone and give them all forgiveness. Is this too good for you to believe? Why do Christians want people to be unforgiven so badly??

Jesus said, "Forgive them for they know not what they do." He said this to the very people that had him crucified. Yet, you don't believe anyone else has forgiveness?

The point is, if you don't believe everyone has forgiveness, then you are perishing. You do not have life and you will never have it abundantly. You don't see people as forgiven. You see them as condemned. You are condemning them and judging them as unforgiven and saying that they deserve eternal damnation in the lake of fire. This view leads to a long slow painful death.

If you believe that Jesus only died and forgave the people that believe in him, then I don't think you know Love. I'm not trying to be mean. I'm just trying to lay it all out there. If you truly know Jesus, I want you to ask him what he thinks about what I've said.

said she said...

You are repeating everything that you said in yoeur video. I heard you the first time. And now, I asked a very specific question, but I don't see that you've addressed it at all:

Do we all get to go to Heaven?

Dathan Ellis said...

No, I didn't say all that in my video. But, I did specifically say that the heaven/hell question is for another video series.

Plus, I've already written somewhat about this: Hell Is Not What You Think It Is (Part 1)

said she said...

But do you believe we all go to heaven?

said she said...

When Jesus started His ministry, the first thing He said wasa: "Repent!"

DO you believe that we must repent in order to get to Heaven?

Dathan Ellis said...

I believe we all go to hell. My "Hell Is Not What You Think It Is" posts (2 parts) explain my stance on hell and heaven. You should read them. Now that I know you know scripture, you need to ask God what will happen after you die.

Yes, Jesus did say to repent. And who were the ones that didn't repent?

said she said...

OK, I've read your dismantling of Hell. But it doesn't answer my basic question, which I feel that I have asked in different ways, but it still remains unanswered.

What is the point? Why be good?

Do you believe that your actions in this life have no effect on the next?

Dathan Ellis said...

I have purposely avoided answering your question. Why? Because, like I said in the first reply, I want you to talk about it with God. I want y'all to sit down and discuss what you think and what he thinks. It doesn't matter what I say. All that matters is what he shows you.

What's the point? Why be good? Because God is so good to you. Jesus gave you a clean slate and the ability to never stress or worry about doing it wrong. He gave you the freedom to simply live and be who he created you to be without having to fear not doing it right. He just simply wants you to live, move, and have your being. Just share the love that he's given you with the people around you and watch the world transform.

This is what I do know. Love keeps no record of wrongs. And, don't worry about tomorrow. Just be the best you that you can be, today.

said she said...

I asked in order to understand your theology. God & I have talked about this, and may other things, and I'm comfortable with my understanding of His will for me.

But you: Do you believe that your actions in this life have no effect on the next?

Dathan Ellis said...

Ok, what is his will for you? What has he told you about forgiveness?

I believe some of your actions have affect in the next life.

DeAnna Johnson said...

I am not trying to be argumentative, only curious. If I understand everything I have read, and granted, I may not have, You believe, much as jehova's witness' do that hell is just death.. absence of God. You believe that we are all saved because all sin was forgiven when Christ was crucified, so there does not need for that mop closet on your knees experience. Our salvation was already granted at that point. So all it takes to get into heaven then is to believe. If you choose to believe, your safe. home plate.. whatever the sins we continue to commit, s'ok cause we believe in God. Is that about accurate?
Because I gotta tell ya... I know a few homosexuals, I myself was molested by someone who genuinely believed in God, I even know someone who tells me that he needs to go to church, has been missing it and that God is telling him needs to go, he just got out of prison for trying to murder three people, has no regrets about , would do it again. And it's all ok they are saved and do not need to bother with all the nasty business of repentance unless they just want to, because their sins are forgiven and they are saved. Have I got that right?

Dathan Ellis said...

I'm not sure what Jehova's Witness' believe. I personally don't know any and I've never been to a Kingdom Hall experience. I doubt they would like me very much.

I believe that even being a believer cannot save you. Even the 1000th of a volt brain function that you use to decide to believe is still a work that you perform. It's something you performed in order to make yourself right. Jesus saved you. Period. Let's be honest. Even Satan believes Jesus is the Son of God, believes he died for everyone, was raised from the dead, and believes God is Lord because he does exactly as God tells him to. Frankly, Satan has a better relationship with God than most Christians do. At least they talk face to face in the wilderness and in God's throne room.

Also, let me use your example. Say you had kids of your own. One was yours and the rest were adopted. You sent your only birthed son to die for all the other adopted kids. He was the perfect sacrifice that nailed all sin to the cross and made them white as snow. You just proved to the whole world that you no longer count their sins against them and that you love them immeasurably. What if a few of those adopted kids were homosexuals, liars, fornicators, murderers, or just didn't get baptized, didn't pray without ceasing, didn't eat only healthy foods, or didn't use their spiritual gifts properly. If you've committed one sin, you've committed them all correct? Well, even if a few of those adopted kids did something tragically wrong (in our eyes) you will still love them and you still forgave them. You would still claim them as your kids, claim them as your own, and love them no matter what.

I wonder what would happen if Christians told the Truth. What if they told people that they're forgiven and that God loves them no matter what? What if Christians no longer condemned people of their sin and just accepted them the way they are? What if they just loved everything about them including their faults? I think the whole world would change and it would catch like wildfire. Love his people.

DeAnna Johnson said...

thank you for responding. I have to pray some more about this.

curious brother said...

Question - along the lines of the others, but somewhat different. (Grant me some leniency, though, as I have only read the comment stream; I have not listened to your video.)

What came first - the chicken or the egg? Did sin enter the world, and then Christ saved us from it? Or, did forgiveness come first?

Dathan Ellis said...

Why no watch video?? I think it's against the rules to read comments and not have time for a 6 min video. Just sayin.

The chicken came first. We always had forgiveness - Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and forever. He forgave then just as much as he forgives now. He proved it by dying on the cross.

curious brother said...

No video, due to lack of time and because I'm at work. But, curiosity got the better of me and I'm drawn in to this discussion.

So, based on your reply, and given the impression that seems to be felt by some of the other commenters, is it your position, then, that nobody in history has failed to enter the presence and glory of God (heaven)? If all are forgiven, even before we sin, and that forgiveness has been available since before history began, then doesn't the mathematical transitive property apply, resulting in all of humankind passing into heaven?

Dathan Ellis said...

In my video I express people's concern and I asked everyone not to focus on heaven or hell. I appreciate you wanting to get involved in the comments, but the comments are relating to the video. For example, you cannot read the book of Hebrews and still provide feedback as if you know the material. I understand if you don't have enough time and resources, but I'd have to ask you to bow out if this is truly the case.

What happens after death is nothing we should be concerned about. Today has enough worries and tomorrow will take care of itself. Let's focus on the now. Today, know that you're forgiven. If you would like to know what happens after you die, I recommend asking your Father. It's what I did. And, he'll freely give wisdom to anyone who asks.

In the mean time, you can read a post I wrote not too long ago on hell called Hell Is Not What You Think It Is (Part 1)

curious brother said...

LOL - nice dodge attempt. I was actually trying to help. I, like you, believe that Jesus Christ paid the price for ALL of mankind. It was a free gift availalbe to any and all willing to accept it. What came first? HE did. Who made the first move? HE did. The only question is this one - Are we (you, me... THAT guy) are we willing to ACCEPT the gift? As James points out to us, just knowing the gift exists is completely meaningless. Even opening the gift and learning about what's inside the pretty paper doesn't get us anywhere. What's important is the RELATIONSHIP between the recipient and the Giver. The gift was given out of love and the only proper response IS love. To love the Giver and to share that love with anyone and everyone that we come in contact with - KNOWING that they are JUST as undeserving of the gift as WE were when we received it and KNOWING that they not be willing (yet) to return that gift in-kind.

So, I agree - don't worry about tomorrow; God is already there. Rather, we should spend today (EVERY today) in close relationship with He who first loved us, and sharing that free and uninhibited love with our neighbors around us.

Dathan Ellis said...

Oh, I was dead serious about you asking God what he thinks. ~:-) It's what I did.

I'm glad you believe that all were forgiven. So many Christians don't even believe this much. However, there is a very minor difference in what you believe and what I believe. It's so small that it's hard to detect. For example, when did you "receive" forgiveness? When you believed you were forgiven, or when Jesus died on the cross 2000 years ago?

The truth is we all have forgiveness. Period. We all have the gift. It was forced on us and we are all certainly using this gift day in and day out whether we know it or not. In fact, you did nothing to receive it. God and Jesus made a covenant among themselves and didn't ask you to participate. They didn't ask for your opinion, what you thought about Jesus dying for you, and didn't give you a chance to object or reject their decision. They did it whether you like it or not. We all already have the gift of forgiveness. Nothing you did. Everything he did.

curious brother said...

I disagree on whether we are asked to participate or not. In fact, I think we should go to lunch again sometime soon and talk about this some more. :)

curious brother said...

For the benefit of any readers who are following this discussion though...

God's commandments are His requests of us. Some would argue that a commandment is an "order" rather than a request. However, I think it can be mutually granted that God did not create robots. Rather, He provided free will for mankind to choose whether or not to follow Him. That choice to chase after him, or not, is His invitation to participate in the relationship. If you are not willing to participate in the relationship, then you are not able to able to enter into His glory. The gift is free and freely available to any and all who are willing to accept and APPLY the gift in their lives. But, just because it is offered to all does not mean that all will receive the benefit the gift is intended to convey.
(that's my 2 cents, anyway)

Dathan Ellis said...

Who is this sneaky person I've been to lunch with? And, hasn't watched my video??

I see what you're saying. You believe that if we haven't applied the gift to our lives then we're not truly forgiven. So, no one truly has forgiveness until they receive it. Therefore Jesus only forgave/forgives the receivers. In your eyes, everyone else is unforgiven.

This makes me sad. I don't think we believe in the same Jesus. Your God only died for receivers. My God forgave everyone.

curious brother (aka...?) said...

That's not what I said. I said the gift is for all. But, the reward the gift is intended to convey is for those who are willing to apply that gift in their lives. The gift of love and forgiveness has been given to all of mankind. The reward for a relationship (like you talk about - one that involves conversation and community with Him) is not enjoyed by all, but only by those willing to participate.

Dathan Ellis said...

Oh, I think I see what you're saying. You're saying everyone is forgiven. Period. But, no one gets into the Kingdom until they have a relationship, or accept a relationship, with Jesus. Is that right?

Anonymous said...

Acts 8:22 we have to ask foregivness no way around it.(Commandment) a divine rule to be strictly observed.

Dathan Ellis said...

So is the command to pray without ceasing. I hope you never stop praying and if you do, you should repent of your sin and ask God to forgive you! As you said, "(Commandment) a divine rule to be strictly observed."

Anonymous said...

I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the comming of our Lord Jesus Christ.1.These.5:17.Pray with out ceasing also comes from Paul he also tried to be all things to all men.